Show Notes
North Korean defector and George W. Bush Institute program manager Joseph Kim joins the podcast to discuss his recent NK News opinion column arguing that analysts and policymakers focus too heavily on Kim Jong Un while overlooking the role ordinary North Koreans could play in shaping the country’s future.
He explains why he believes North Korea should be understood as a country experiencing profound social change rather than simply a nuclear-armed state controlled from the top.
The conversation also explores how the growth of informal markets has changed both the economic lives and thinking of North Koreans, creating spaces to exchange information and reducing dependence on the state. Joseph reflects on his own experience surviving around the jangmadang, the impact of the failed 2009 currency reform and whether marketization could ultimately strengthen the regime as well as weaken it.
He also discusses the role of foreign media, arguing that increasingly harsh punishments for consuming outside information reveal how seriously Pyongyang views the threat it poses to state propaganda.
About the podcast: The North Korea News Podcast is a weekly podcast hosted by Alannah Hill exclusively for NK News, covering all things DPRK — from news to extended interviews with leading experts and analysts in the field, along with insight from our very own journalists.
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Editor’s note: This interview was recorded in July 2026. Some references to recent events and political developments reflect the situation at the time of recording and may differ from subsequent developments.
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