How Can Economies Thrive While The World Cuts Carbon?

As countries across the world strive to reach their climate targets, they must make sure that the move to a cleaner energy system supports economic growth. The Energy Podcast explores this difficult balancing act. Presented by Julia Streets. Featuring Dr Rob Charnock of the Metis Institute for Climate Strategy, climate scientist and advisor Dr Yvonne Maingey-Muriuki and Shell’s chief economist Dr Mallika Ishwaran. The Energy Podcast is a Fresh Air Production for Shell, produced by Annie Day and Sarah Moore, and edited by Eno Alfred-Adeogun. Episode Transcription: 00:00:00 Julia Streets: Today on The Energy Podcast.

00:00:07 Speaker 2: Economic growth and developmental sustainability are not mutually exclusive.

00:00:13 Speaker 3: With a strong talent pool of young entrepreneurs and qualified engineers, we are pressing forward with solutions in climate-smart agriculture, water conservation, clean energy innovations, and more.

00:00:29 Speaker 4: Let us come together to build resilient, sustainable and green businesses, communities, and countries of the future.

00:00:39 Julia Streets: The dust has settled on COP28, and the main takeaway was clear; the world is falling short of its climate targets. But as the leaders who gathered at the conference highlighted, there remains an appetite to do better while simultaneously ensuring economies keep turning. The question is, how? The climate summit showcased diverse approaches. Some nations prioritised boosting the supply of lower carbon energy to meet demand and remain competitive. Others advocated for increasing funding in renewables to attract investment and spur the creation of more jobs. And while some countries pushed for a complete phase-out of all fossil fuels, others favoured a phase-down, where coal, oil, and gas usage is reduced rather than eliminated as a more economically viable plan. The reality is, different solutions will be needed in different places, and countries will move at different paces to achieve net- zero. Hello, I'm Julia Streets, and today on the Energy Podcast as we look ahead to 2024, we ask: how can economies thrive while the world cuts carbon? Joining me today are guests, Dr Yvonne Maingey-Muriuki, who is a climate scientist and strategic practitioner to organisations operating in Africa. Dr Rob Charnock who is director of the Metis Institute for Climate Strategy, and Shell's chief economist, Dr Mallika Ishwaran. Now, before we look ahead to what this year and beyond may have in store, let's take a moment to reflect on where things currently stand. Rob, I'm going to come to you. How would you rate the current global progress in cutting carbon?

00:02:27 Dr Rob Charnock: I think what was incredibly interesting to see at the recent COP, was that it's the first global stocktake, so we really get a sense of how close we are to being on track towards the targets set out in the Paris Agreement. And what I thought was very encouraging is, previously we thought we were on track for somewhere between 2. 7 to 3.6 degrees of warming, but as we get more and more commitments coming through that are updated as well after a few years, we see that we're getting closer. Now, that's not to say we're on track for 1. 5 or even well below two degrees at the moment.

00:02:58 Julia Streets: Some areas of the economy are more challenging to decarbonise than others. I mean, I think particularly industry and transport as well, but they are central to economic growth. I'm curious to think about what's the way forward, and Mallika, I'd love to come to you for your thoughts on that.

00:03:16 Dr Mallika Ishwaran: So what we are seeing is there's a sector by sector difference in how the different sectors are progressing in the transition. I think you can see the evidence is there that power is decarbonising, renewables are coming in at scale and really are changing and disrupting the system. But there are other sectors. I would put passenger EVs as part of the