Noise in Nature and Law

Presented by the City Bar's African Affairs Committee, host Justin Loveland, a commercial litigator who previously served as a legal consultant to Seychelles' Truth, Reconciliation and National Unity Commission, is joined by four leading voices in transitional justice who have worked on or alongside truth commissions across the continent: Professor Ron Slye (Kenya and South Africa), the Honorable Bernard Georges (Seychelles), and Didier Gbery and Dr. Baba Jallow (The Gambia).

Our episode today features Mindfulness and Well-Being in Law Committee members Robye Margolius (director of wellbeing at Arnold & Porter) and Jordana Confino (founder and CEO of JC Coaching and Consulting). They discuss social wellbeing as a powerful but overlooked dimension of lawyer wellbeing, defined as having meaningful, supportive relationships and a sense of connection and contribution. Robye and Jordana outline research linking social support to happiness, life satisfaction, reduced depression and anxiety, and improved physical health, and cite workplace findings that belonging boosts performance and retention. The conversation explores barriers in legal culture such as time pressure, transactional interactions, invulnerability norms, autonomy needs, and perfectionism, plus the effects of billable-hour incentives, hybrid work, phones, and AI on connection and mentorship.

Lorraine McGowen brings us today’s podcast from the City Bar’s Presidential Task Force on Artificial Intelligence and Digital Technologies. The discussion covers expanding legal use cases (research, drafting, due diligence, e-discovery, deposition and hearing prep, judicial chambers), ROI concerns due to verification burdens, and persistent hallucination risks. Panelists emphasize “trust nothing and verify everything,” including checking citations, quotations, and whether law remains good. We review ethics and court-rule developments (New York Part 161; proposed California SB 574), sanctions trends, confidentiality and privilege risks from public AI tools, client restrictions and protocol controls, record retention and supervision frameworks, international implications such as the EU AI Act’s risk categories and penalties, and the need for AI literacy and ongoing training. Lorraine McGowen is Co-Chair of City Bar’s Task Force and a Partner at Orrick, Herrington and Sutcliffe. She is joined by these experts in the field: Maura Grossman – Research Professor, School of Computer Science, University of Waterloo David Keyko – Partner, Pillsbury, Winthrop, Shaw, Pittman Sabina Ahmed Liconte – Head of Legal and Chief Compliance Officer, the Americas, ICBC Standard Bank Group Adele Hogan – Partner, Hogan Law Associates Ann Heo – Co-Chief of Discovery Compliance and Litigation Unit and Chief of the Prescription Drug Investigations Unit, Officer of the Special Narcotics Prosecutor for the City of New York Kristin Baylis – Senior Technology Counsel, Orrick

The horrific attacks on September 11, 2001, left New York City in dire need of help. Families were searching for missing loved ones, and those who lost loved ones could not access support without a death certificate. Small businesses and street vendors in Lower Manhattan lost their livelihoods overnight. Immigrants were targeted and detained.

Pema Sherpa is a mindfulness researcher and keynote speaker who helps organizations boost employee well-being and performance. Born and raised in Nepal, she studied the mind-body relationship at Harvard University and teaches mindfulness in a way that's both philosophically grounded and useful for people in demanding careers. She co-authored The Daily Buddhist with her husband, pairing short, daily teachings with practical, modern application.