Decouple

The Birth of America’s Nuclear Power Industry

Decouple

Show Notes

James Krellenstein returns to take apart one of the most persistent myths in energy discourse: the idea that there was a golden age when nuclear power was cheaper than coal. The plants people point to, Oyster Creek, Dresden, Point Beach, Quad Cities, were cheap to the utilities that bought them, but they were not cheap to build. General Electric and Westinghouse sold them as fixed-price turnkey projects at a deliberate loss, eating roughly 1 billion in 1960s dollars, more than 10 billion adjusted for inflation, across about a dozen plants. This loss leader strategy paid off. Between 1962 and 1976 the US nuclear fleet doubled its capacity roughly every 2 years, a stretch of sustained growth that rivals anything in American industrial history and still constitutes the largest nuclear fleet on earth in 2026. The conversation traces how turnkey era prices distorted every nuclear cost comparison that followed, why the utilities themselves pushed to abandon turnkey contracts, and how regulatory change, slowing load growth, and across-the-board cost inflation turned the boom into a wave of cancellations. Krellenstein closes on the fundamental question for the present moment: if we want to set off another ordering cycle, someone has to absorb first-of-a-kind risk with a balance sheet large enough to guarantee a firm fixed price, and it is not obvious who that is. Back then GE and Westinghouse could swallow the losses because they were two of the largest industrial conglomerates on earth and commercial reactors were a single-digit percentage of their business. No comparable actor today has shown any willingness to take that risk on, which explains both how the world's largest nuclear fleet got built and why nobody has been willing to repeat the trick since. Listen to Decouple on: • Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6PNr3ml8nEQotWWavE9kQz • Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/decouple/id1516526694?uo=4 • Overcast: https://overcast.fm/itunes1516526694/decouple • Pocket Casts: https://pca.st/ehbfrn44 • RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/23775178/podcast/rss Website: https://www.decouple.media

More from Decouple

Oct 15, 2026

How did a tiny, impoverished country whose principal exports included Jaffa oranges become the world's sixth nuclear power? Nuclear historian Avner Cohen, author of Israel and the Bomb and The Worst-Kept Secret, joins Decouple to tell the extraordinary story of Israel's clandestine nuclear weapons program. From David Ben-Gurion's determination to prevent another Holocaust to Shimon Peres's secret dealings with France during the Suez Crisis, we explore how Israel acquired the technology, financed the construction of Dimona, bypassed its own democratic institutions, and deceived American inspectors determined to establish whether its nuclear ambitions were peaceful.We examine Israel's improvised nuclear preparations during the Six-Day War, the alleged nuclear alert of 1973, the mysterious 1979 Vela incident in the South Atlantic, and the secret understanding between Nixon and Golda Meir that institutionalized Israel's policy of nuclear opacity. Cohen explains how Israel has maintained an arsenal that everyone knows exists but nobody officially acknowledges, and how this extraordinary arrangement has shaped Middle Eastern geopolitics for more than half a century. Finally, we turn to Iran, Israel's determination to preserve its regional nuclear monopoly, and the terrifying strategic vulnerability captured in former Iranian president Rafsanjani's description of Israel as a "one-bomb state."Listen to Decouple on:• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6PNr3ml8nEQotWWavE9kQz• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/decouple/id1516526694?uo=4• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/itunes1516526694/decouple• Pocket Casts: https://pca.st/ehbfrn44• RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/23775178/podcast/rssWebsite: https://www.decouple.media

Sep 25, 2026

The Canada-US trade war is escalating, threatening to unravel decades of economic integration between two of the world's closest allies. Chris Keefer is joined by returning guest Jesse Hoops to examine how we got here, what Washington hopes to achieve, and how Canada can respond to an increasingly unpredictable neighbour. From tariffs on aluminum and autos to the potential collapse of Canadian manufacturing, they explore the consequences of economic warfare between countries whose industries and supply chains have become deeply intertwined. Can Canada defend its economic sovereignty without inflicting even greater damage on itself, and what might ultimately force an end to the conflict?The conversation explores Canada's critical vulnerabilities, including the Gordie Howe Bridge, Line 5, American-controlled financial infrastructure and the F-35 fighter program. Chris and Jesse examine whether Canada needs to sacrifice some economic efficiency to secure greater strategic autonomy, including through new pipelines, domestic industrial capacity and a more independent nuclear supply chain. With billions of dollars in new nuclear construction on the horizon, what does the trade war mean for Canada's choice between CANDU and the American-designed AP1000? And if the current rupture in Canada-US relations becomes a recurring feature of American politics, how much should Canada be prepared to spend to ensure it cannot be held hostage by its largest trading partner?Listen to Decouple on:• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6PNr3ml8nEQotWWavE9kQz• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/decouple/id1516526694?uo=4• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/itunes1516526694/decouple• Pocket Casts: https://pca.st/ehbfrn44• RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/23775178/podcast/rssWebsite: https://www.decouple.media

Sep 3, 2026

Canada is once again attempting to build nuclear megaprojects after a long pause, making the experience of people who have actually delivered recent large industrial projects increasingly valuable. Ian McGregor is a veteran Alberta engineer, entrepreneur and industrial project developer who helped conceive and build the $12 billion Northwest Sturgeon Refinery and the Alberta Carbon Trunk Line.In this episode we use that project to explore the realities of megaproject delivery: incomplete engineering, supply-chain delays, labour bottlenecks, cost escalation and the challenge of coordinating thousands of critical components across a vast industrial site. We also dive into the refinery’s near-disastrous gasifier burner failure, where a mission-critical component designed to last thousands of hours failed after just 40, forcing McGregor and a small team of engineers and tradespeople to redesign it themselves. From there the conversation broadens into the economics of nation-building infrastructure, why governments often have to play a role in projects with century-long paybacks, and what Canada’s nuclear revival can learn from one of the country’s most ambitious recent industrial megaprojects.Listen to Decouple on:• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6PNr3ml8nEQotWWavE9kQz• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/decouple/id1516526694?uo=4• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/itunes1516526694/decouple• Pocket Casts: https://pca.st/ehbfrn44• RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/23775178/podcast/rssWebsite: https://www.decouple.media

Aug 13, 2026

Fusion has spent nearly a century as the energy source of the future. In this episode, I’m joined by fusion scientist Gerrit Bruhaug to ask what has actually been achieved, what remains unsolved, and why progress has taken so much longer than the early pioneers expected. We start from first principles, how fusion differs from fission, why the Lawson criterion matters, and how magnetic and inertial confinement take radically different routes to the same goal. Gerrit provides an in-depth analysis of the National Ignition Facility’s breakthrough and why ignition is better understood as fusion’s Chicago Pile moment, rather than the near-term arrival of a commercial power plant.From there we get into the engineering realities behind the headlines: laser efficiency, plasma instabilities, neutron damage, divertor heat loads, tritium breeding and inventory, target manufacturing, parasitic loads, engineering breakeven and the enormous gap between making fusion happen and making cheap electricity.Gerrit also takes us through fusion’s surprisingly long history, from the optimism of the first private laser-fusion startup, KMS Fusion, to today’s new wave of heavily capitalized companies, and explains why the two constraints he watches most closely are tritium inventory and engineering gain.Listen to Decouple on:• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6PNr3ml8nEQotWWavE9kQz• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/decouple/id1516526694?uo=4• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/itunes1516526694/decouple• Pocket Casts: https://pca.st/ehbfrn44• RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/23775178/podcast/rssWebsite: https://www.decouple.media

Aug 6, 2026

Iran’s nuclear program is now more than seven decades old, stretching from the Shah’s ambitious Atoms for Peace-era plans to the Islamic Republic’s pursuit of enrichment, missile capability and nuclear latency. Iran historian Farzan Sabet joins Decouple to explain how energy development, techno-nationalism, the trauma of the Iran–Iraq War and a persistent sense of strategic isolation transformed a civilian nuclear project into an increasingly important national-security instrument.We trace the program through the Shah’s plans for 23,000MW of commercial nuclear power, the revolution, the AQ Khan network, the AMAD weapons effort, the JCPOA and the collapse of Iran’s traditional deterrence architecture. Farzan also examines the extraordinary price Iran has paid: sanctions-related economic damage measured in the hundreds of billions of dollars and, by one estimate, comparable to the economic cost of the Iran–Iraq War, yet with neither substantial nuclear power generation nor a nuclear deterrent to show for it.Listen to Decouple on:• Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6PNr3ml8nEQotWWavE9kQz• Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/decouple/id1516526694?uo=4• Overcast: https://overcast.fm/itunes1516526694/decouple• Pocket Casts: https://pca.st/ehbfrn44• RSS: https://anchor.fm/s/23775178/podcast/rssWebsite: https://www.decouple.media

See all episodes →