040: "The Scientists" feat. Allen Epley (Shiner, The Life & Times, BirdHands)

Joining me today from Evanston, IL is ALLEN EPLEY — singer, songwriter, guitarist, bassist, & loop-maker — of the bands SHINER, THE LIFE & TIMES, & BIRDHANDS.

Shiner’s about a week away from the second half of their fall tour, with upcoming dates starting October 4th in Lawrence, KS, then moving across the north- & southwest for a couple weeks after.

Those shows will, in part, celebrate the release of THE Y SECTION, a career-spanning collection of b-sides, loosies, & rarities, out October 9 via SPARTAN RECORDS. In early November, they’ve got 4 dates in Japan: one night in Kyoto & Nagoya, & two in Tokyo.

Their excellent 2025 record, BELIEVEYOUME, which we talk about later in the episode, came out just over a year ago this month, also on Spartan. Links below.

From 2019 to 2025, he hosted THIRD GEAR SCRATCH, a podcast about the practical realities of making art today & what it takes to survive creatively in a mostly unforgiving world. There are many many great conversations, but definitely tune into the interview he recorded live @ Fitzgerald’s with Matt Talbott, if you haven’t already. That’s episode 100. It’s a rare view into Matt’s creative process & projects, direct from the source. Link below.

So check out all of that, along with Allen’s other projects The Life & Times, BirdHands, his solo record Everything, & his lesser-discussed quartet Spacesuit, who released a lovely slow, moody, & atmospheric record called Future Girls back in 2013.

In this episode, we talk about keeping the math seductive, the textures of puncturing the fourth wall, the Kansas City-Champaign nexus, & the simple sonics of the psychedelic glow.

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THE Y SECTION

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BELIEVEYOUME

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SHINER TOUR DATES

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T.G.S. 100: MATT TALBOTT

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THE LIFE AND TIMES

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BIRDHANDS

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ALLEN EPLEY, EVERYTHING LP

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SPACESUIT

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03:15 // “Surgery” (Shiner) 04:27 // Fall Tour ’26 06:20 // The Y Section Compilation 10:34 // “Only Shallow” (MBV/Shiner) 14:45 // “A Sailor’s Fate” & Barkmarket 20:24 // 4th Wall Breaks, BYM, & “The Alligator” 28:23 // Vocal Inspirations 30:31 // CD Renaissance 34:38 // Andy Mueller’s Shiner Designs 42:13 // HUM in KC 49:18 // Downward is Heavenward / “The Scientists” Discussion 01:11:51 // "Christ-Sized Shoes" (Shiner)

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Further Listening:

GRIFTERS, Crappin' You Negative

BARKMARKET, Gimmick & L. Ron

CHEAP TRICK, "Mandocello"

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