Naomi Ostwald Kawamura: Dreaming of Histories That Heal

Land Return is not a historical debt already being settled. It is a live, present-day argument over who gets to hold title to the ground beneath us. In this episode, we travel to Santa Fe for a conversation recorded live on the eve of the Santa Fe Indian Market with Jodi Archambault, Founder and CEO at ANPO; Dallas Goldtooth, Environmental organizer, Actor and Co-Founder of The 1491s; and Alvin Warren, Vice President of Policy & Impact at the LANL Foundation, in conversation with Rohit Menezes, Partner at The Bridgespan Group. The conversation moves from definitions — title transfer versus co-management — to a deeper argument that land is the source of language, song, and sovereignty itself. Together, the panel presses past land return as a historical debt already being settled and toward what it would mean to treat it as an active, ongoing responsibility. Jump straight into: 00:00 Introduction, recorded live in Santa Fe on the eve of the Santa Fe Indian Market. 03:58 Alvin welcomes the audience to Tewa homelands, in place of the show's usual invocation. 09:46 Jodi draws the line between land return, co-management, and full title transfer. 17:54 Dallas explains how “Empire accommodates, it does not liberate.” 19:49 Alvin reframes land theft as a present-day activity, not a historical one. 28:57 Jodi recounts being asked point-blank why tribes should have to buy back their own land. 33:59 Dallas on the Black Hills settlement money tribes have refused to touch. 39:22 Jodi on human rights, relatives beyond the human, and the cost of becoming “indoor humans.” 46:09 Alvin on the responsibility his ancestors were gifted, and what it demands now. 1:07:49 Alvin closes on the trillions derived from stolen land, and who shouldn't “get cheap.” Resources Organizations and Institutions Referenced: ANPO — founded by Jodi Archambault, an organization focused on the interconnectedness of Indigenous lands, languages, and cultures: https://www.anpo.org/ The 1491s — Native American sketch comedy group co-founded by Dallas Goldtooth: https://www.allamericanspeakers.com/speakers/452181/The+1491s LANL Foundation — where Alvin Warren serves as Vice President of Policy & Impact: https://lanlfoundation.org/ Santa Clara Pueblo's Land Claims Rights Protection Program — established by Alvin Warren: https://www.santaclarapueblo.org/programs/community-services/rights-protection/ California's tribal nature-based solutions program — a $100 million state investment in tribal land reacquisition referenced by Alvin, credited in part to Geneva Thompson, Deputy Secretary of Tribal Affairs at the California Natural Resources Agency: https://resources.ca.gov/Initiatives/Tribalaffairs/TribalNatureBasedSolutionsProgram Other Resources “This Land” — Rebecca Nagle's podcast on tribal sovereignty and land rights, referenced by Alvin: https://www.crooked.com/podcast-series/this-land/ #DreamingInColor #DEI #LeadersOfColor

Burnout is not a personal failing among today's changemakers. It is a systemic cost, one that philanthropy, movements, and communities can no longer afford to ignore. In this episode, we travel to New Orleans for a live conversation on the importance of rest, co-produced with Beloved Community. Gabrielle Wyatt, Founder and CEO at The Highland Project; Rhonda Broussard, Founder and CEO at Beloved Community; and Charmel Gaulden, CEO and President at Foundation for Louisiana, come together to explore rest as a personal practice, a source of spiritual grounding, and an essential part of the infrastructure that sustains movement work. The conversation moves from individual habits: walking, writing, dance, prayer, to the systems that either protect or erode rest for the people doing the most demanding work. Together, they consider what it would mean to build rest into philanthropy, leadership, and community life, not as an afterthought, but as a strategy for sustaining people and movements.

Art doesn't emerge in isolation, and it doesn't end there either. What we owe our artists, and what they owe us back, shapes the culture we all inherit. In this episode, we return to Whitechapel Gallery in London for part two of our conversation with Mariana Mazzucato, Whitechapel Economist in Residence and Professor at University College London; Alvaro Barrington, Artist; and Darren Isom, Partner at The Bridgespan Group, in conversation chaired by Gilane Tawadros, Director at Whitechapel Gallery, as part of the gallery's Art Futures series on the value of culture. Picking up where part one left off, Alvaro reflects on the creative eras and communities that shaped his own practice before the floor opens to audience questions. Together, the panel explores what artists owe their communities, what philanthropy owes when it comes from a place of love rather than obligation, and why measuring what we value may be the key to building something different. Jump straight into: 01:01 Alvaro Barrington reflects on the creative eras that shaped him, from Motown to hip-hop. 07:07 Mariana Mazzucato reframes philanthropy through pre-distribution, not redistribution. 13:11 An audience member asks whether imagination should lead culture, or emerge from it collectively. 15:48 Alvaro on making art that your community, friends, and family genuinely love. 18:32 Why blockbuster culture crowds out the very ecosystems that create it. 20:41 Darren reframes philanthropy through the lens of Black communities' oldest traditions. 23:23 An audience member asks how artistic labor finally reaches the people who hold power. 27:50 A question of reciprocity: what do artists owe back to the city and economy? 34:58 Closing reflections on imagination, permacrisis, and why culture is not a luxury. Resources Organizations and Institutions Referenced Whitechapel Gallery — the London gallery hosting the Art Futures series. The Bridgespan Group — the philanthropic advisory firm where Darren Isom is a partner. UCL Institute for Innovation and Public Purpose (IIPP) — Mariana Mazzucato's institute at University College London. Bezos Earth Fund — referenced in the discussion as an example of philanthropy detached from its source of wealth. Campaign for the Arts — the UK arts advocacy charity represented by an audience question during the panel. Other Resources Have You Heard George's Podcast? — the Peabody Award-winning podcast by George the Poet (George Mpanga), referenced in the discussion on creativity and community investment. #DreamingInColor #DEI #LeadersOfColor

Value is never simply discovered by markets — it's decided, together, by what a society chooses to fund, protect, and imagine into being. And too often, culture is treated as decoration rather than infrastructure. In this episode, we travel to Whitechapel Gallery in London to speak with Mariana Mazzucato, Whitechapel Economist in Residence and Professor at University College London; Alvaro Barrington, Artist; and Darren Isom, Partner at The Bridgespan Group, in conversation chaired by Gilane Tawadros, Director at Whitechapel Gallery, as part of the gallery's Art Futures series on the value of culture. Together, they explore why culture has been pushed to the periphery of economic and political life, and what it might mean to place it back at the center. Mariana opens with a provocation on rethinking value itself, before the conversation turns to public funding, philanthropy, imagination, and what institutions owe the communities they serve. Jump straight into: 04:50 Mariana Mazzucato argues culture belongs at the center of economic thinking, not its edges. 08:48 Rethinking the common good means designing economies with people, not simply for them. 12:50 Public Practice shows how public institutions once relied on in-house creative and design expertise. 16:55 Static metrics like ticket sales miss the deeper value that institutions create. 21:49 Darren Isom reflects on imagination as central to strategy, not ornamental to it. 25:40 Alvaro Barrington challenges the room to reconsider what government and art owe each other. 30:08 Public investment quietly built today's AI industry, a history rarely part of the conversation. 36:05 Darren traces his optimism to generations who learned to find light in darkness. 39:31 Good philanthropy acts as a force of permanence, not a replacement for government. Resources Organizations and Institutions Referenced Whitechapel Gallery — the London gallery hosting the Art Futures series, marking its 125th anniversary in 2026. Art Futures: The Value of Culture — the Whitechapel Gallery talks series exploring the role of public art institutions. UCL Institute for Innovation and Public Purpose (IIPP) — Mariana Mazzucato's institute at University College London. Public Practice — a UK nonprofit placing architects and designers within local government. V&A East — the Victoria and Albert Museum's East London site, referenced in the discussion on public value. The Bridgespan Group — the philanthropic advisory firm where Darren Isom is a partner. Other Resources The Common Good Economy: A New Compass — Mariana Mazzucato's book (Penguin, 2026), the foundation for her provocation in this episode. #DreamingInColor #DEI #LeadersOfColor

Episode Notes: What we build, and what we choose to save, reveals what we believe the future is owed. In this episode, we travel to Chicago's South Side — to The Land School, a building Theaster Gates rescued from demolition — for a conversation about Black cultural production, community stewardship, and the long arc of institution-building. We speak with Theaster Gates, Artist & Founder and Executive Director at Rebuild Foundation; Michelle Boone, President and CEO at The Poetry Foundation; Marshall Hatch Jr., Co-Founder and Executive Director at MAAFA Redemption Project; and Faheem Majeed, Artist, Educator, and Co-Founder and Co-Director at Floating Museum. Together, they explore what it means to build and sustain worlds of possibility rooted in art, faith, place, and the slow, deliberate work of community. The conversation moves through questions of time and transformation, the distinction between culture and artist, how faith shapes long-term vision, and what it actually requires to invest in futures we may not live to see. Rooted in the specific geography of Chicago's South and West sides, it is also a conversation about what any city owes the people who made it. Jump straight into: 00:00 Introduction. 02:50 Theaster Gates on his calling: stopping the demolition of Black space. 04:50 Michelle Boone on growing up less than a half mile from The Land School and returning to the community that shaped her. 06:30 Faheem Majeed on Margaret Burroughs, the South Side Community Arts Center, and building with rather than for. 08:50 Marshall Hatch Jr. on his grandfather's 1924 journey from Mississippi to Chicago and what it means to carry a 100-year inheritance. 12:50 Structure as permission, not limitation, and why a neighborhood needs 50 years to think about its total transformation. 15:35 Buying land before speculation, seeing beauty when things are not beautiful, and building an infrastructure of language that says Black people deserve great places to be. 17:50 Philanthropy's resistance to long-term thinking and why the goal of great cultural work is not to survive forever, but to build toward a future where it is no longer needed. 21:00 Cathedral thinking, the Sankofa Wellness Village, and 33 years of community-building in West Garfield Park. 31:00 Faith in the unseen, Reinhold Niebuhr, and why receiving the baton and passing it on is liberation. 37:46 The arrogance of perpetuity and making the case for going hard and deep with philanthropic resources. 46:35 Funders as collaborators and why transparency and dialogue produce better outcomes than performance. 47:00 The difference between art and arts, why systems love culture but resist artists, and the extraction problem in cultural philanthropy. Resources: Rebuild Foundation: Theaster Gates's cultural organization dedicated to neighborhood revitalization on Chicago's South Side through art, preservation, and community development. The Poetry Foundation: An independent literary organization committed to a vigorous presence for poetry in our culture, home to Poetry magazine. MAAFA Redemption Project: Marshall Hatch Jr.'s organization working at the intersection of faith, healing, and community restoration in West Garfield Park, Chicago. Floating Museum: Faheem Majeed's co-founded arts organization operating on the principle that the city is the museum, neighborhoods are galleries, and citizens are cultural producers. South Side Community Art Center: One of the oldest African American art institutions in the United States, foundational to Faheem Majeed's practice. Other Resources: Toni Morrison: Referenced in the opening invocation: "This is precisely the time when artists go to work. There is no time for despair, no place for self-pity, no need for silence, no room for fear. We speak, we write, we do language. That is how civilizations heal." W.E.B. Du Bois: Referenced by Marshall Hatch Jr.: "Art is the spirit that knows beauty." Reinhold Niebuhr: Theologian referenced by Marshall