Show Notes
Note that bookshop.org links are affiliate links that generate a small commission to support the show if you purchase books using these links. Sign up for the Drafting the Past newsletter for updates on the show and more. Hi everybody! I'm taking this week off to work on some things behind the scenes, so I wanted to talk this chance to replay an episode from early in the podcast that I love. I know many of you are devoted listeners who have listened to every episode of the show, but in case you're newer to the podcast, here's a chance to revisit an earlier interview. Back in August 2022, I first released my interview with Dr. Isabela Morales. She had recently published her first book, Happy Dreams of Liberty, and she was working multiple jobs in public history. I particularly love this episode because Isabela speaks so poignantly about her commitment to narrative history and holding on to that writerly spirit in graduate school. I'm very pleased to report that after we spoke, Happy Dreams of Liberty went on to win multiple well-deserved book awards, including the prestigious Frederick Douglass Book Prize in 2023. I reached out to Isabela for an update on what she's working on these days. At the end of 2025, she wrapped up her time at the Stoutsburg Sourland African American Museum, and is now working full-time on her second book. She hinted at that book at the end of this interview, and it's now under contract with Liveright for W. W. Norton and tentatively titled The Black Widow of Hazel Green. Here's what Isabela told me about that book: It is a biography of Elizabeth Dale, a wealthy white plantation mistress and enslaver in antebellum Alabama, who was married six times and to this day is rumored to have murdered some or all of her husbands. While I think six dead husbands is enough to pique most people's interest, I also find Elizabeth Dale interesting historically as an embodiment of white women's deep but often-overlooked complicity in the institution of slavery. Having read Happy Dream of Liberty, I am eagerly awaiting Isabela's new book. In the meantime, though, it's inspiring to revisit this conversation with her. Even if you're heard this one before, I think you'll be rejuvenated by another listen. And if it's your first time, you're in for a treat. I'll be back next week with another fantastic new episode. Until then, please enjoy this marvelous interview from the archive, with Dr. Isabela Morales. Original show notes: For this episode of Drafting the Past, I interviewed Dr. Isabela Morales, writer and public historian. She is the editor and project manager of The Princeton & Slavery Project and the digital projects manager at the Stoutsburg Sourland African American Museum, central New Jersey's first Black history museum. Dr. Morales received her Ph.D. in history from Princeton University in 2019, specializing in the 19th-century United States, slavery, and emancipation. Her first book, Happy Dreams of Liberty: An American Family in Slavery and Freedom, was published earlier this year by Oxford University Press. We talked about how work as a public historian influences her writing, why guinea pigs are essential to her process, and the fiction she reads to learn how to evoke a place and time. MENTIONED IN THE SHOW: Find Isabela Morales on Twitter, @IsabelaWrites Evernote, the software Isabela uses for organizing her research Tiya Miles, Ties that Bind Martha Sandweiss, Passing Strange Erik Larson, The Devil in the White City Hilary Mantel, Wolf Hall and A Place of Greater Safety Martha Hodes, The Sea Captain's Wife Daniel Sharfstein, The Invisible Line Suzanne Lebsock, A Murder in Virginia
More from Drafting the Past
Visit draftingthepast.com for even more great nonfiction history book coverage, including book reviews, interviews with authors, and new book releases. Note: Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links. If you buy books through these links, you support independent bookstores, our authors, and Drafting the Past! About this episode: In this episode, Kate is joined by Dr. Shane White, the emeritus Challis Professor of History at the University of Sydney. Shane is a historian of US history, especially African American history, and has written or co-written seven books. His newest book is A Moment in the Sun: Black Manhattan Before the Civil War, and it is the product of decades of thinking and research. In it, he details the world of Black men and women in antebellum New York, bringing to life characters and moments that might otherwise be overlooked. As you’ll hear, it’s a book that emerges out of Shane’s incredibly detailed and intimate knowledge of one dense body of sources in particular, the district attorney’s records in the Municipal Archives of the City of New York, hundreds of thousands of files that date back to the 1790s. Listen to their conversation to learn about Shane’s dogged approach to research and his reflections on a career as a historian of the United States who lives and works in Australia. Mentioned in this episode: Shane White, A Moment in the Sun: Black Manhattan Before the Civil War Shane White, Prince of Darkness: The Untold Story of Jeremiah G. Hamilton, Wall Street’s First Black Millionaire Shane White and Graham White, The Sounds of Slavery: Discovering African American History Through Songs, Sermons, and Speech Shane White and Graham White, Stylin’: African American Expressive Culture from Its Beginnings to the Zoot Suit Shane White, Stephen Garton, Stephen Robertson, and Graham White, Playing the Numbers: Gambling in Harlem Between the Wars Shane White, Stories of Freedom in Black New York Shane White, Somewhat More Independent: The End of Slavery in New York City, 1770-1810 The David Abraham scandal Rhys Isaac, The Transformation of Virginia, 1740-1790 Ian Tyrrell Michael McDonnell, Masters of Empire: Great Lakes Indians and the Making of America Robert Caro, The Power Broker: Robert Moses and the Fall of New York and the Lyndon Johnson books
Visit draftingthepast.com to subscribe and get episode updates, history book reviews, and more. You can subscribe for free, or, if you want to support our work and get ad-free episodes and articles, exclusive content, and other perks, become a paid subscriber today. Note: Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links. About this episode: When Katherine Grandjean’s new book, Kingdom of Devils: A Tale of Murder in the Shadow of the American Revolution, came out earlier this summer, somehow I missed it. But I’m awfully glad someone corrected that for me (shout out to historian Robert Parkinson), because this was a remarkable book. In it, Grandjean follows the trail of a pair of brothers who terrorized the Kentucky and Tennessee countryside for nine months in 1798, murdering dozens of people for reasons that were unclear to their contemporaries and to the people who have written about them for the past two hundred years. Grandjean not only tells a gripping, beautifully written story, but she weaves it with the uncertain political and social atmosphere of the United States in the wake of the American Revolution. It’s a story about masculine violence, class, property, and the creation of the nation, and it has surprising resonance even now. Dr. Katherine Grandjean is an associate professor of history at Wellesley University, and a historian of early America. Her first book was American Passage: The Communications Frontier in Early New England. In our conversation, she had insightful things to say about building tension, balancing narrative threads, and the hard, tireless work it took to track down the evidence that makes a story like this possible to write. Mentioned in this episode: Katherine Grandjean, Kingdom of Devils: A Tale of Murder in the Shadow of the American Revolution Katherine Grandjean, American Passage: The Communications Frontier in Early New England Jane Kamensky Jill Lepore F. Scott Fitzgerald, The Great Gatsby Margaret Atwood, Cat’s Eye
Bookshop.org links are affiliate links. Subscribe for free to the Drafting the Past newsletter for podcast updates, book reviews, and more. Paid subscribers get ad-free episodes and exclusive content. In this episode, Kate interviews Dr. Thomas Andrews, a historian who cares deeply about the writing—and revision—process. Thomas is a professor of history at the University of Colorado Boulder and is also the faculty director of the Center for the American West. He’s the author of three books, including the Bancroft-award winning Killing for Coal: America’s Deadliest Labor War, Coyote Valley: Deep History in the High Rockies, and his newest book, The Great Horse Flu: A Forgotten Pandemic and the Fate of Reconstruction America. In addition to his own writing, he has interviewed historians as part of the Writer’s Studio feature in the journal Modern American History, which is a series of terrific interviews about how some of the most highly regarded American historians work. As you might imagine, Kate and Thomas had a great time talking about the writing process and especially Thomas’ love of revision. This one also includes a treadmill desk, a harrowing publishing tale, and why he might have taken Bill Cronon’s dissertation advice a little too seriously. Mentioned in this episode Thomas Andrews, The Great Horse Flu: A Forgotten Pandemic and the Fate of Reconstruction America Thomas Andrews, Coyote Valley: Deep History in the High Rockies Thomas Andrews, Killing for Coal: America’s Deadliest Labor War Susan Orlean, “The Walking Alive,” on using a treadmill desk Writer’s Studio feature archives in Modern American History journal Linda Gordon William Cronon Richard White Donald Worster Patricia Limerick Curb Your Enthusiasm
Note: Links to bookshop.org are affiliate links. Thanks for supporting the show and independent bookstores by purchasing books through these links! About this episode For this episode, Kate is joined by Eric Jay Dolin, the New York Times-bestselling author of 17 books, to talk about his writing process and what it’s like to build a career as an author of popular histories. His books include Leviathan: The History of Whaling in America; A Furious Sky: The Five-Hundred-Year History of America’s Hurricanes; Black Flags, Blue Waters: The Epic History of America’s Most Notorious Pirates; and Rebels at Sea: Privateering in the American Revolution. His most recent book is The Wreck of the Mentor: A True Story of Death, Despair, and Deliverance in the Age of Sail. His books have won awards and are frequently named best books of the year. Before writing history books, Eric worked in environmental policy and earned a PhD in environmental policy and planning from MIT. We talked about how his career has developed, the ups and downs of the book market, and he dished about advances, career trajectories, and why he thinks he’d rather have a huge book now than early in his career. Mentioned in this episode: Eric Jay Dolin, The Wreck of the Mentor: A True Story of Death, Despair, and Deliverance in the Age of Sail Samuel Eliot Morison, The Maritime History of Massachusetts, 1783-1860 Erik Larson, Isaac’s Storm: A Man, a Time, and the Deadliest Hurricane in History James Truslow Adams, The Founding of New England
Visit draftingthepast.com to sign up for the newsletter and get book reviews, podcast updates, and much more. Note: Bookshop.org links are affiliate links. About this episode: How many history books have kept you up late into the night, turning the page to find out what happens next? That’s exactly what the newest book from this episode’s guest did to Kate, but it was well worth the lost sleep. Catherine Grace Katz joins the Drafting the Past podcast to talk about her newest book, Shadow Before the Flame: The Hindenburg Disaster and the Prelude to War. Catherine is a writer, historian, and lawyer, with degrees in history from Harvard and Cambridge along with a JD from Harvard. Her first book was Daughters of Yalta: The Churchills, Roosevelts, and Harrimans: A Story of Love and War. She joined Kate to talk about what goes into writing such extraordinary true stories, from how she works without an outline to the writing tool she found in her mom’s basement, and the unlikely inspiration for the book in a classic holiday movie. Mentioned in this episode: Catherine’s website Catherine Grace Katz, Daughters of Yalta: The Churchills, Roosevelts, and Harrimans: A Story of Love and War Catherine Grace Katz, Shadow Before the Flame: The Hindenburg Disaster and the Prelude to War William L. Shirer, The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich: A History of Nazi Germany William L. Shirer, Berlin Diary Norman MacLean, Young Men and Fire Gioia Diliberto, Firebrands: The Untold Story of Four Women Who Made and Unmade Prohibition Tana French Patrick Radden Keefe, London Falling: A Mysterious Death in a Gilded City and a Family’s Search for Truth and Say Nothing: A True Story of Murder and Memory in Northern Ireland Phillippe Sands, The Ratline: The Exalted Life and Mysterious Death of a Nazi Fugitive, and the podcast precursor, Intrigue: The Ratline Helena Merriman, Tunnel 29: The True Story of an Extraordinary Escape Beneath the Berline Wall and its podcast precursor, Intrigue: Tunnel 29 The Creative Nonfiction Podcast with Brendan O’Meara Pitch Club