Show Notes
My latest guest is John O’Connor, author of A Short, Strange Trip: An Untold Story of Magic Mushrooms, Madness, and a Search for the Meaning of Life in the Amazon, which was published today (April 14, 2026). This is the story of Terence McKenna, arguably the single most important figure in popularizing psilocybin mushrooms in the late twentieth century United States. In the early 1970s, McKenna traveled to the Colombian Amazon in search of psychedelics and, in the end, believed he’d discovered the key to saving humanity. Though he is perhaps better known for his “stoned ape theory,” which posits the importance of psychedelics in the evolution of Homo sapiens. In the 1990s he spread his ideas through various publications and, most importantly, on the American lecture circuit, helping to reignite interest in these substances. All of this would eventually morph into today’s psychedelic renaissance. In this episode John and I talk about McKenna, Colombia, writing, and our own adventures with these drugs. It’s a great conversation. As always the podcast is available through Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Pocketcasts, and the Substack app. On April 15, I will begin serializing a chapter from the book on the newsletter. No subscription necessary, but we appreciate you signing up (it’s free). Episode Outline 0:00-4:09: Introduction. 4:09-20:22: Podcast critiques, the new book, psychonauts, McKenna and his mission, True Hallucinations, Roger Casement, La Chorrera, the “hippie trail,” Richard Evans Schultes, psychedelics in Colombia. 20:22-51:45: Setting the record straight, personal experiences with psychedelics, fun versus therapy, what LSD meant in the 1980s, “set and setting” and drugs, identifying with the Sixties during the 1980s, more on psychedelics and fun, do psychedelics have to be therapy? 51:45-1:05:39: Roland Griffiths, the challenges of psychedelic therapy, quackery, indigenous psychedelics versus the global market, psychedelics and violence in the Amazon. 1:05:39-1:15:48: On becoming a writer, what makes for a successful travel story, writing books versus magazine articles. 1:15:48-1:24:13: Regrets, last thoughts on the impact of Terence and Dennis McKenna, psychedelics and bullshit. 1:24:13-End: Outro.
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More from History on Drugs Podcast
My latest guest is independent scholar David Tuch, author of The Wireless Operator: The Untold Story of the British Sailor Who Invented the Modern Drug Trade (Icon Books, 2025). The book tells the story of Harold Derber, the man who pioneered the “mothership” smuggling technique that dominated U.S. drug trafficking during the 1970s. It’s a remarkable tale of true crime that takes us from the Battle of the Atlantic through the Arab-Israeli War and the Cuban Revolution. There are connections with Fidel Castro, John F. Kennedy, the Gambino crime family, and even Francis Ford Coppola. Derber lived a truly extraordinary life before he was assassinated in the late 1970s. He was also David’s cousin. We discuss all of it in this fascinating conversation. As always the podcast is available through Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Pocketcasts, and the Substack app. Episode Outline 0:00-3:11: Introduction. 3:11-16:11: Intro to Harold Derber, the origins of the research, David’s background, adding color to a historical narrative. 16:11-32:42: Derber’s background, WWII, the Arab-Israeli War, smuggling arms to the Dominican Republic, Derber’s motivations. 32:42-53:43: Sarah Cohen and her diaries, Derber’s mob ties, Francis Ford Coppola, James Donovan, the Bay of Pigs prisoners, Victor Piña Cardosa, shuttling Cubans to Miami, Castro, Derber deported. 53:43-1:06:11: Stealing boats in Latin America, drug trafficking and the invention of the “mothership,” cutting a deal with Cuban intelligence, Derber as a potential CIA asset? 1:06:11-1:14:36: His assassination as he was about to testify in the First Jersey Securities case, the Gambino crime family, the murder of his lookalike, who was it that killed Derber? 1:14:36-1:18:25: How David researched all of this. 1:18:25-end: Outro.
My latest guest is drug-history pioneer David Herzberg. In two important books—Happy Pills in America: From Miltown to Prozac (Johns Hopkins, 2008) and the prize-winning White Market Drugs: Big Pharma and the Hidden History of Addiction in America (Chicago, 2020)—David has put pharmaceuticals at the center of addiction history in the United States. David is also co-editor of drug history’s flagship journal, The Social History of Alcohol and Drugs. We talk about David’s fascinating journey through the late twentieth-century United States, heroin, methadone, White Market Drugs, how to talk to your kids about intoxicants, and David’s hope that we can make drugs boring again. It’s a great conversation. As always the podcast is available through Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Pocketcasts, and the Substack app. Episode Outline 0:00-4:02: Introduction. 4:02-20:14: Early life, hard times as a Jewish kid in Arkansas, finally being recognized as a good student in Vermont, the possible influence of all of this on David’s scholarship, early interest in history, an eccentric high-school teacher. 20:14-41:35: Miserable at Harvard, dropping out, doing some very hapless wandering around the western United States, Eugene, becoming a tree planter amidst heavy drug users. 41:35-55:34: Getting out of Eugene and moving to Portland (Oregon), returning to Vermont and then going back to college, dumping science and then sociology for history, thinking about graduate school and the history of education. 55:34-1:18:22: Graduate school at Wisconsin, women’s history, getting interested in pharmaceuticals and how they were advertised, Paul Boyer, Judy Leavitt, Ron Numbers, heroin, methadone, drug education, and talking to your kids about drugs. 1:18:22-1:34:09: What David learned when he started researching drugs, making drugs boring again, debating whether drugs are special, the inspiration for White Market Drugs, and the Groundhog Day of prescription-drug epidemics. 1:34:09-end: Outro.
My latest guest is Emily Dufton. Emily is an independent scholar and historian who has written a lot about drugs over the years. Her first book, Grass Roots: The Rise and Fall and Rise of Marijuana in America (Basic Books, 2017), told the roller-coaster story of the marijuana-legalization movement since the 1960s. Her new book, Addiction, Inc.: Medication-Assisted Treatment and America’s Forgotten War on Drugs (University of Chicago Press, 2026), is about methadone maintenance and other forms of medication-assisted treatment (MAT) during roughly the same time period. As Emily explains, most addiction researchers will tell you that the best way to treat opioid addiction is medication-assisted, yet this approach to treatment continues to carry heavy stigma and is underutilized in the United States. In her book, and in this conversation, Emily explains why. We also talk about being a writer, growing up in Allentown, Pennsylvania, the Nixon Administration, Emily getting hazed by Jerome Jaffe, and more. As always the podcast is available through Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Pocketcasts, and the Substack app. Episode Outline 0:00-5:08: Introduction. 5:08-13:15: Academic versus popular publishing, book synopsis and inspiration, medication-assisted treatment (MAT) defined. 13:15-17:24: Allentown, deindustrialization, and opioids. 17:24-21:24: Researching MAT, Michael Massing’s The Fix, getting hazed by Jerome Jaffe. 21:24-29:15: The history of methadone, the Nazis, methadone maintenance in the USA, Vincent Dole and Marie Nyswander. 29:15-38:40: The US in the 1960s, the French Connection, heroin in Vietnam, Nixon’s declaration of “war on drugs,” the supposed John Erhlichman quote. 38:40-48:29: Nixon’s concerns about crime, Jeff Donfeld and Bud Krogh, Robert DuPont, Jerome Jaffe, the advantages of methadone, the very loud critics and methadone’s fall from grace in the 1970s. 48:29-1:10:07: The revival of MAT, the AIDS crisis, COVID-19, the story of Buprenorphine, heroin in the ‘90s, the Drug Abuse Treatment Act of 2000, the launch of Suboxone, Shaun Thaxter, Reckitt Benckiser Pharmaceuticals. 1:10:07-1:17:57: Why isn’t MAT reaching more people? 1:17:57-end: Outro.
My latest conversation is with Graham Harding, author of Champagne in Britain, 1800-1914: How the British Transformed a French Luxury (Bloomsbury, 2023). Graham and I met last spring in London, where we talked about the history of champagne during the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, along with the fascinating history of “branding,” which came of age during the same period. Graham has not only studied branding with academic rigor, but also lived it during a long career in marketing and advertising prior to becoming an academic. Additionally, he has published A Wine Miscellany: A Jaunt Through the Whimsical World of Wine, which has been described as “a thorough and entertaining collection, sprinkling facts and lore on the history, culture, business and science of savoring and making wine.” This episode is filled with booze, business, and some great stories. As always the podcast is available through Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Pocketcasts, and the Substack app. Episode Outline 0:00-5:30: Introduction. 5:30-7:56: The unexpected bonuses of publishing Champagne in Britain. 7:56-18:21: Early life, Cambridge, working in publishing, advertising, and marketing. 18:21-28:25: Leaving the business world for academia, getting into wine, A Wine Miscellany, developing his dissertation topic, champagne and the origins of modern marketing, nineteenth-century “influencers,” product placement. 28:25-41:58: The science of champagne bubbles, the early history of champagne, “Sir Farter,” making champagne drier in Britain and the origins of the drink we enjoy today. 41:58-49:55: The birth of modern branding, the intersection of taste and social history, why champagne was better for branding than “still” wine. 49:55-57:16: The history of the term “branding,” why champagne became the drink of the aristocracy. 57:16-1:05:41: Graham’s family background and its possible relationship to his career path, going back to school in his 60s, working with William White, Christina de Bellaigue, and Peter Mandler. 1:05:41-1:16:45-: New collaborative projects, craft vs. science in pinot noir. 1:16:45-end: Outro.
My latest guest is Stephen Snelders of Utrecht University. Stephen and I met up in Amsterdam last March to talk about drugs, history, and the Netherlands. A native of Amsterdam, Stephen watched up close as the various drug scenes in that great city evolved during the 1980s. This helped turn him into a drug historian, initially studying the history of LSD in his country, and eventually publishing Drug Smuggler Nation: Narcotics and the Netherlands, 1920-1995 (Manchester University Press, 2021). We talk about the 1960s and Amsterdam, the development of the famous Dutch system of cannabis “tolerance,” the deep roots of drug smuggling there, organized crime, and much more. As always the podcast is available through Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, Pocketcasts, and the Substack app. Episode Outline 0:00-4:04: Introduction. 4:04-9:14: Early life and education, getting into history, the 1980s in Amsterdam. 9:14-14:40: Graduating from college, the MDMA/House rage, learning that you could get paid to do a PhD, deciding to work on the history of LSD in the Netherlands, doing an oral history of the Amsterdam drug subculture. 14:40-23:20: The development of LSD in the Netherlands in the 1950s and ‘60s, Simon Vinkenoog and the Beats, happenings, the Provo countercultural movement, the road to cannabis “toleration,” Bart Huges and the “third eye,” the 1980s and MDMA. 23:20-31:12: Today’s psychedelic renaissance and its lack of a countercultural vibe, professionalization of psychedelic therapy, psychedelics as PEDs and as part of the neoliberal project. 31:12-43:12: “Smart shops,” mushrooms, “truffles,” coffee shops and Dutch pragmatism, the transformation of cannabis from a hippie drug to something else, criminal involvement in the cannabis market. 43:12-48:49: 1990s homegrown cannabis, Ed Rosenthal, smuggling, new raids on coffee shops, organized crime, medicinal cannabis. 48:49-51:58: Prostitution in the Netherlands and the Amsterdam Red Light District. 51:58-55:35: Finishing the dissertation, first job, the field of medical history, academia in the Netherlands. 55:35-1:06:40: The long history of Dutch drug smuggling, organized crime today in the Netherlands. 1:06:40-1:13:04: Is the illicit market “working”? 1:13:04-end: Outro.