Ep 50: The Elements Series: Crime, Compassion & Cliffhangers - John Boyne's Masterclass in Human Nature

In this episode, Leanne and Chelle talk with Kimberley Allsopp about her second novel. It follows August and Noah, a Brisbane couple who have been together for over a decade. Nothing has gone terribly wrong: no cheating, no villain, no big drama. Things are just… fine. But what happens when fine isn’t enough? Kimberley tells us why she wanted to explore what comes after the point where most rom-coms finish. We also talk about the milk. Who notices when it’s running low? Who remembers to buy more? It’s a small detail in the book that says a lot about how the mental load in a relationship so often falls to one person. Her agent asked for less milk talk, and Kimberley refused. Kimberley is also very funny. She tells us about a possum that ate her lemon before she could photograph it for publication day, and about how hard it is to come up with book titles that don’t sound like Taylor Swift songs. And Chelle shares her favourite line from the book, which had us both nodding: “There was never a break from being a woman.” About Kimberley Allsopp Kimberley is the author of Love and Other Puzzles and Rise and Shine. She has worked in bookselling and publishing since 2008 and is a campaign manager at HarperCollins. She lives in Brisbane. * Instagram: @kimberleyallsopp * Buy the book: Booktopia Read along with us Want to talk books with authors like Kimberley? Join the Between The Lines Book Club to read along with us, meet authors at live events, and connect with a community of readers who see reading as self-care. BOOK MY SPOT

What do we inherit from the world and the people in it, and what do we do with it? In this episode, Leanne and Chelle talk with Ellena Savage about her debut novel, The Ruiners. Pip is a university dropout working at a Melbourne lobster shack. When her long-absent father dies and leaves her $50,000, she and her boyfriend Sasha, an ambitious young scholar, buy a run-down house on a struggling Greek island. The island doesn’t turn out to be the dream they imagined. "I wanted it to feel like a dinner party with too many people talking and too much food." — Ellena Savage

How do friendships survive when the people we love are experiencing the very thing we're desperately longing for, avoiding, grieving or questioning? In this episode of Between The Lines, we're joined by New Zealand actor, journalist, playwright and author Elisabeth Easther to discuss her novel Seed. The story follows four women navigating very different experiences of fertility, pregnancy and motherhood. Hilary desperately wants a baby. Maggie is happily navigating life as a single mother. Shelley is returning to work after having two children. And Virginia, who has spent her career caring for other people's babies, suddenly decides she wants one of her own. Their lives may look very different, but their experiences collide in ways that are funny, messy, uncomfortable and deeply human. Elisabeth shares how Seed grew from her own experiences of pregnancy loss and fertility treatment, alongside the very different reproductive experiences of women around her. While she was trying desperately to become pregnant, friends were experiencing unexpected pregnancies, miscarriage and abortion. Some felt unable to tell her what was happening in their own lives because they wanted to protect her. That experience planted one of the most compelling ideas in the novel: even among close friends, the things we don't say to protect one another can sometimes create distance instead. We talk about how fertility can completely change the dynamics of friendship, the strange transition from spending years trying not to become pregnant to suddenly desperately wanting pregnancy to happen, and the enormous variety of experiences hidden behind the seemingly simple question of whether someone wants children. And despite the subject matter, Seed is also very funny. Elisabeth brings warmth and humour to experiences that are complicated, painful and sometimes absurd. In this episode we discuss: The personal fertility experiences that inspired Seed

Is it ever too late to discover a different version of yourself? In this episode of Between The Lines, we're joined by Australian author Mikki Brammer to discuss her wonderful new novel, Good Joy, Bad Joy. For more than eighty years, Joy and Hazel have been best friends. But while Hazel has lived boldly and adventurously, Joy has spent her life doing what was expected of her: being a devoted wife, loving mother and good neighbour. When Hazel is given only months to live, Joy begins to wonder whether playing it safe has meant missing out. What starts with a determination to live a little more boldly soon involves mischief, petty crime and a very late coming of age. But underneath all the fun is a deeply thoughtful story about friendship, ageing, identity and the ways we can continue to change throughout our lives. Mikki describes the novel as an ode to lifelong friendship, very late bloomers and the thrill of dabbling in a little mischief. We talk about the great romance of platonic love and the friends who don't just complement us, but show us parts of ourselves we haven't yet discovered. We also explore Joy's relationships with her husband and daughter, and the realisation that a lifetime spent avoiding conflict hasn't necessarily protected her relationships. Instead, saying the difficult things may be exactly what allows those relationships to deepen. In this episode we discuss: Joy and Hazel's extraordinary eighty-year friendship Why Mikki wanted to write about the great romance of platonic love Being a late bloomer and having more than one "coming of age" The difference between living through someone else's adventures and discovering what you're capable of yourself How our experiences with our own parents can shape the way we parent Conflict avoidance and why keeping the peace doesn't always create closeness Joy's unlikely friendship with her neighbour Rowan Ageing, invisibility and the boxes society places people in Challenging our assumptions about other people Regret as an invitation to change rather than something simply negative Why small, everyday regrets can matter more than the grand ones The idea of being "cautiously reckless" Why a quiet life can be every bit as meaningful as one lived loudly Mikki's first novel, The Collected Regrets of Clover, and the themes connecting the two books This is a conversation about friendship and ageing, but ultimately it's about possibility: remaining curious about ourselves, other people and the lives we might still choose to live.

What happens to the parts of ourselves we put aside when we become who everyone else needs us to be? In this episode of Between The Lines, Leanne is joined by author and psychologist Lauren Keegan to discuss her haunting historical novel, The Woman in the Seal Skin. Set on the remote Orkney Islands in 1695, the novel follows Mali, a young woman raised on stories of selkies: shape-shifting women who shed their seal skins to walk on land. Mali has always done what is expected of her. Now married and expecting her first child, her life appears safe and predictable. But beneath it all is a yearning for the sea and for a part of herself she has never been allowed to fully know. Lauren shares how traditional selkie folklore inspired the novel, particularly the story of a woman whose seal skin is stolen, trapping her on land as a wife and mother until she eventually reclaims it and returns to the sea. From there, our conversation explores something that will feel familiar to many women: the tension between loving the people and roles in our lives and still yearning for something that belongs entirely to ourselves. We talk about motherhood and identity, the judgement placed on women who pursue their own needs, and why having something that brings us back to ourselves can be so important. We also explore the darker side of folklore. Who gets to tell the story? Who benefits from the version that survives? And what happens when stories about women are used to frighten them, control them or keep them small? In this episode we discuss: The selkie folklore that inspired The Woman in the Seal Skin Why Lauren chose Orkney in 1695 as the setting Motherhood and the yearning to retain a sense of self The impossible judgement women can face whether they prioritise their children or themselves Why our passions don't need to serve anyone else to be worthwhile Female oppression, violence and the ways stories can be used to control women How folklore can help communities explain loss, tragedy and things they don't understand The sea as a metaphor for emotion, thought, freedom and wildness Bessie as an outsider, healer and woman who has embraced her own wildness Lauren's work as a psychologist in perinatal and infant mental health and how her interest in women's experiences connects with her writing The relationship between nature, folklore and human experience across Lauren's novels This is a beautiful conversation about motherhood, identity and the parts of ourselves that continue calling to us, even when life has taught us to keep them quiet.