Show Notes
If scaling laws hold—and Surge AI CEO Edwin Chen believes they do—we’re hurtling toward a future where there’s nothing humans can do that AI can’t do better. When OpenAI’s models disproved an open conjecture posed by mathematician Paul Erdős using novel algebraic geometry techniques, Fields medalist Timothy Gowers felt the shift acutely. He initially thought the model had proved an upper bound, and braced himself: that would mean it was “all over for mathematicians very soon.” When he realized it had only found a counterexample, he was relieved—it bought him another year or two before the thing he’s devoted his life to becomes something AI does better. As founder and CEO of the company behind the data environments and evals the major model companies use to train their models, Chen has a unique perspective on how quickly AI models are absorbing tasks we used to think of as uniquely human. Dan Shipper talked with Chen for AI & I about what the act of creating or building means when AI can do it better—and whether an answer to that question already exists within science fiction. If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! Join the membership for Where You Live at https://www.joinbilt.com/dan To hear more from Dan Shipper: Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow him on X: https://twitter.com/danshipper Timestamps: 00:00:54 Introduction 00:01:49 Surge as a "school for AGI" 00:04:46 What AI's capacity for novel mathematics says about human achievement 00:07:29 Motivation in an era when AI can do everything 00:14:34 The trap of optimizing AI models for engagement 00:29:34 Training using datasets versus training using environments 00:35:09 The value of personal data 00:39:40 Why models are bad at writing 00:42:00 Chen's AGI timeline Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Edwin Chen on X: https://x.com/echen Surge: https://surgehq.ai Riemann-bench (research-level math benchmark): https://surgehq.ai/leaderboards/riemann-bench Hemingway-bench (creative writing benchmark): https://surgehq.ai/leaderboards/hemingway-bench Talkie-1930 (language model trained on pre-1930 text): https://huggingface.co/talkie-lm/talkie-1930-13b-it Ted Chiang, “What’s Expected of Us”: https://www.nature.com/articles/436150a Every is the most AI-native startup on the internet. Through ideas, software and education, subscribers get the tools to work at the frontier of AI. Start your free trial today: https://every.to/subscribe?utm_source=youtube Follow Every: https://x.com/every Follow Dan Shipper: https://x.com/danshipper
More from The Every Podcast
Check out Gemini Audio: https://goo.gle/Every-Gemini-Audio Every time a new AI model drops, companies face the same dilemma: Figure out what’s new and how to use it, or focus on getting work done. Every solves this dilemma with a frontier team: a small group that tests new models and turns useful experiments into tools and workflows for the rest of the company. On this week’s episode of The Every Podcast, Natalia Quintero sits down with all seven members of Every’s frontier team to ask what they’re building—from a tabless browser that helps protect your attention to a personal agent orchestrator called Minga—and what they want to try next. Subscribe to Every (free for 14 days): https://every.to/youtube-every-offer?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=audio&utm_campaign=companyagentepisode Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Follow Every: https://x.com/every Compound Writing plugin: https://every.to/guides/compound-writing Every’s vibe checks: https://every.to/vibe-check Follow Dan Shipper: https://x.com/danshipper Follow Natalia Quintero: https://x.com/NataliaZarina Follow Mike Taylor: https://x.com/hammer_mt Follow Jack Cheng: https://x.com/jackcheng Follow Arielle Shipper: https://x.com/ArielleShipper Follow Katie Parrott: https://x.com/kplikethebird Follow Jannik Jung: https://x.com/JannikJung 0:00 Introduction: Why every company needs a frontier team 2:42 Why the best frontier teams have pirates and architects 4:57 How Head of Evals Mike Taylor builds personal benchmarks 6:46 How Opus edited an explainer video using Slack messages and meeting notes 10:20 Working with AI means protecting other people’s attention 12:26 Why a frontier team needs a “wrangler” like Arielle Shipper 18:58 Why senior editor Jack Cheng built a tabless browser 24:37 How resident writer Katie Parrott teaches her AI writing plugin who the reader is 30:51 Inside engineer Jannik Jung’s personal AI orchestrator 35:41 Compound engineer Kieran Klaassen uses AI to build power tools
Check out Gemini Audio: https://goo.gle/Every-Gemini-Audio Bet on founders who understand the technology, because their first idea probably won’t be the one that sticks. That’s the view of Matt Hartman, founder and managing partner of Factorial Capital. In 2016, as a partner at Betaworks, Hartman was part of the team that wrote the first check into Hugging Face, which was then a chatbot app for teenagers. Today it’s the largest hub for open-source AI, and Nvidia has agreed to buy it for about $13 billion. On this week’s episode of The Every Podcast, Hartman tells Natalia Quintero how backing Hugging Face shaped his investment thesis, how Factorial grew into a “family tree” of technical founders who help him scout deals, and why vibe-coding his own app gave him a new respect for SaaS. Subscribe to Every (free for 14 days): https://every.to/podcast-every-offer?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=audio&utm_campaign=matthartmanepisode Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Factorial Capital: https://factorialcap.com Ghost Pepper, Matt's open-source voice-to-text app: https://github.com/matthartman/ghost-pepper Superpowers, Jesse Vincent's skill for Claude Code: https://github.com/obra/superpowers Hugging Face: https://huggingface.co Follow Every: https://x.com/every Follow Natalia Quintero: https://x.com/NataliaZarina Follow Matt Hartman: https://x.com/MattHartman 0:00 Introduction 5:06 How Hugging Face went from a teen chatbot to the home of open-source AI 9:52 The three decisions that set Hugging Face on its path 12:49 Hartman’s approach to finding the newly technically possible 18:10 Why Hartman backs technical founders 21:10 How Factorial’s portfolio founders source its next deals 27:09 Why faster iteration makes product insight the most valuable skill 34:28 What Hartman learned building Ghost Pepper, an open-source voice-to-text app 40:02 Hartman’s current theses, from non-language models to full-stack AI apps 44:14 Why the best founders right now are experimenting
Subscribe to Every (free for 14 days): every.to/podcast-every-offer?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=audio&utm_campaign=companyagentepisode On this week's episode of The Every Podcast, Dan Shipper sits down with Willie Williams, Every's head of platform and one of the driving forces behind the Every Agent, which launched this week. They discuss how Every went from everyone running their own OpenClaw to relying on one shared company agent—and where they think personal agents belong in everyday life. Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Willie Williams on X: https://x.com/bigwilliestyle The Every Agent: https://every.to/agent?utm_source=podcast&utm_campaign=podcast&utm_content=1006companyagent OpenClaw: https://openclaw.ai Tend, Dan's open-source feed app: https://every.to/tend?utm_source=podcast&utm_campaign=podcast&utm_content=1006companyagent Every’s Vibe Check on Dots: https://every.to/vibe-check/vibe-check-dots-always-on-agents-in-chatgpt?utm_source=podcast&utm_campaign=podcast&utm_content=1006companyagent Dot from OpenAI: https://openai.com/index/introducing-dots/ 0:00 Introduction 5:58 How OpenClaw spread through Every 11:13 Why everyone's personal agents eventually died 14:51 The difference between building for builders and building for operators 16:20 Why work will run on company agents while personal agents will stay personal 19:56 How engineering management has changed in the age of AI 21:43 Using an AI-powered feed to see everything happening across a product launch 23:53 Why Willie's token usage fell off a cliff 29:05 The benefit of having separate AI coaches for each part of your life 31:45 How Every is building its agent to surface information unprompted
Sam Altman's Dot, OpenAI's new always-on agent, gave him back the most productive part of his day.
Two years ago, Katie Parrott was laid off from a crypto firm and couldn’t afford a career coach—so she turned to a $20-a-month ChatGPT subscription instead. The Every staff writer’s habit of feeding AI good context eventually became compound writing, a codified system for brainstorming, drafting, and editing with AI. Today, that system is a plugin any writer can use. On this week’s AI & I, Natalia Quintero talks with Katie about turning good ingredients into good writing, borrowing the taste of writers she admires, and why AI helped her fall back in love with the page. If you found this episode interesting, please like, subscribe, comment, and share! To hear more from Natalia Quintero: Subscribe to Every: https://every.to/subscribe Follow her on X: @NataliaZarina Go to https://attio.com/every and get 15% off your first year. Timestamps: 0:00 Start 0:49 Introduction 1:21 How Katie went from being laid off to using ChatGPT as a career coach 8:06 Turning AI into a “content agency of one” 10:59 Building the context files and style guides that make AI outputs useful 14:15 What makes a Claude project actually work 21:18 How AI helped with a mental health crisis and “computer errands” 27:03 Katie’s career coach, now a fully autonomous Codex project 32:27 What compounding means, and building the Compound Writing plugin 38:00 Borrowing Vonnegut, Hitchcock, and Sorkin as AI editing skills 44:49 Katie’s thesis: education and access will matter more than ever Links to resources mentioned in the episode: Katie Parrott on X: @kplikethebird Compound writing plugin: https://github.com/EveryInc/compound-writing Compound engineering plugin (Kieran Klassen): github.com/EveryInc/compound-engineering-plugin Parrott’s companion piece on compound writing: https://every.to/guides/compound-writing Parrott, “I Hired ChatGPT as My Career Coach”: every.to/working-overtime/i-hired-chatgpt-as-my-career-coach Parrott, “AI Turned Me Into a Content Agency of One”: every.to/working-overtime/ai-turned-me-into-a-content-agency-of-one