This is Fine! A podcast about resilience engineering and software

Root Cause Analysis vs. Resilience Engineering w/special guest Lorin Hochstein

This is Fine! A podcast about resilience engineering and software

Show Notes

A history of the 5 whys and root cause analysis from papers

Some critiques of the 5 whys:

From John Allspaw: https://www.oreilly.com/radar/the-infinite-hows/

From Alan J Card: https://qualitysafety.bmj.com/content/26/8/671

James Reason and the Swiss Cheese Model:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8514562/

James Reason’s book Human Error: https://bookshop.org/p/books/human-error/9e06d8a100a07537?ean=9780521314190&next=t

And a classic from Sidney Dekker (et al.) on the implication of complexity within safety investigations:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0925753511000105?via%3Dihub

We always recommend the Howie Guide: https://howie-guide.pagerduty.com/

STAMP is starting to get popular: https://functionalsafetyengineer.com/introduction-to-stamp/ Google’s STAMP paper: https://www.usenix.org/publications/loginonline/evolution-sre-google

Google’s STAMP discussion on ProdCast: https://sre.google/prodcast/#season4-episode7

And presentation at SRECon: https://www.usenix.org/conference/srecon25americas/presentation/klein

Nancy Leveson’s google scholar is always worth browsing: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=78y4sEcAAAAJ&hl=en

Allspaw’s LinkedIn post that we quoted: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jallspaw_important-reminders-about-learning-effectively-activity-7378775591447183360-c_eD

Lorin’s Law: https://surfingcomplexity.blog/2017/06/24/a-conjecture-on-why-reliable-systems-fail/

Want to talk more about this subject? We’re doing a live event co-sponsored by RISF and you can sign up for it here: https://resilienceinsoftware.org/networks/events/146485

More from This is Fine! A podcast about resilience engineering and software

Oct 20, 2026

WARNING: **Colette may have forgotten how to talk for a bit during this episode. We’ve tried to keep the edit streamlined, but cuts are because of the presence of so many “ums” and a migraine.

Sep 1, 2026

If you want to come to the event to chat with Layer Aleph folks about Crisis Engineering you can sign up here: https://resilienceinsoftware.org/events/272451

Aug 28, 2026

Chad’s thesis from Lund is here: https://lup.lub.lu.se/luur/download?func=downloadFile&recordOId=9076274&fileOId=9076276

Jun 28, 2026

Aerobarrier is super cool if you want to check out how it works: https://glbipro.com/aerobarrier-2/

May 14, 2026

The new website is live! thisisfinepod.com

See all episodes →